13:22

Please do not discuss the test questions. Please do not completely read this without voting on the threads first after learning what to do, if applicable. Maradith, Amber, Joesph, Frank and Riley are standing in a line. Amber is fifth in line while Joseph is in the middle of the line. Frank is second in line. Riley is at the beginning of the line. Please select what you believe to be a right answer for this poll: [poll=p165][/poll] Please do the same on this one: [poll=p166][/poll] Subject 2 is on hiatus as I now lack a desire to mention it. Omiwa Cycloptic Smile: A Study ~ between numbers; between people If one loves themself, they are ... what Act II

jeez maybe this test is too hard ewe goodness 6 numbers I don't agree with were picked 5 people I don't agree with were picked that actually is very unfavorable to my "theory" which is that people don't assume betweens to be inclusive with people but do with numbers which I thought was stupid gosh I have wondered why I made the order complex, but couldn't go back I've also wondered why I didn't make it multi vote because that's better I guess I just hate multi votes Oh well this silly community _{maybe I am thE silly one actually}

For the record, Frank is the only person known to be between Riley and Amber. For instance, if the line consisted of 11 people, the middle place would be 6th. So if even you don't know the right answer... To reiterate myself, if you were to clearly communicate your intent, it would be better for you, as well as everyone else. I hope you take this lesson to heart someday.

Your interpretation is unusual, I think. I've met someone else with one like it, even so. If I ever try to do as I'd wanted again, I do hope that I will do better.

... but the result of your poll shows that your notion of 'usual interpretation' is not so good. If you had asked about what you wanted to know, rather than try and understand a secondary consideration of people's answers with a question you yourself didn't understand - it would have served you better.

I don't have a normal perception. I don't know if that will ever change, so I should possibly just give up

The point I'm trying to drive at is how you express yourself, more than how you perceive. If you were to treat communication as cooperation, you'll get farther.

I don't know if I understand what you're saying. If you mean cooperating by agreeing to what you said, then I think I've considered it. A reply as small as "You're right" didn't seem worthy of even being said, so I hadn't said it Sorry You're right

No, when I use the phrase 'cooperate', I do not mean 'agree with me'. I mean, among other things, stop removing yourself one tier from the communication. Hiding in chat. Over-using indirect communication. Needlessly confusing a second issue into the discussion, especially when it confuses something you want clarified. This is a pattern - you distance yourself from things. This makes for more effort on your part, more effort on everyone's part, for less effectiveness. Get in there. Participate in the conversation, as if you're in the conversation. Say what you mean and mean what you say. Cooperate. Things go better. This is something I'm sure you could understand. But, you're the one who has to put the effort into understanding it. No-one else can do that for you.

I don't know how to reply. I've read what you said, though.

Thanks for the acknowledgement. Good luck.

Oh the results are out, I'm surprised Frank wasn't the most popular one

I believe that most people picked Maradith because no direct information about their position was given.

I don't see how so many people picked maradith. I've never even heard that name.

I don't see how so many people picked maradith. I've never even heard that name.

That could be another reason why more people picked them.

For the record, Frank is the only person known to be between Riley and Amber. For instance, if the line consisted of 11 people, the middle place would be 6th. So if even you don't know the right answer...

I said this as well and explained my interpretation in chat (the "someone else"). Omiwa seems to have believed that "... are standing in a line" implied that they were the only ones in the line. miwa also explained that the reason for this post was to determine (I use this word, but "attempt to prove" would be better) his assertion that people are more likely to interpret a statement of "between people" as exclusive and "between numbers" as an inclusive group. This is not a bad inquiry, but was carried out poorly and ignores the possibility that the statement of particular numbers primes a respondent to not choose them (as with "pick a number between 1 and 5"). For some reason, miwa finds this common interpretation of "between" as inclusive as unjustifiably wrong and abhorrent, for what I assume is the reason of not interpreting the statement literally, even though at least in the context of numbers it is a social assumption for the benefit of both groups that the range is inclusive.

It's "wrong" for "between" to mean inclusive-between... by some definitions. By other definitions, e.g. "bounded by", it is not wrong. Using interval notation, (1,5) is "a set of numbers bounded by 1 and 5". So is the interval [1,5], and (1,5], and [1,5). In response to "Pick a number in an interval bounded by 1 and 5", it is correct to say "[1,5] is an interval bounded by 1 and 5, and 1 is a number in that interval". EDIT: I was partway through making a point and left it hanging, sorry. The point is, to be a cooperative communicator, when it comes to interpreting words, you don't get to choose just one definition which you like. If someone says "Time flies"... you could reply with "The definition of 'flying' is 'travelling by air'... time does not travel by air, so you're talking nonsense". But, not to put too fine a point on it, that's being an ass. To be a cooperative communicator, you recognize that one interpretation doesn't make sense... so you look for another interpretation for which the words make sense: to fly, "to move or pass quickly". Where the conversation goes: A: Pick a number between 1 and 5 B: 1 A: That's not between 1 and 5, by one of the definitions of "between" then, A is being an ass, in the same way as "'Time flies' is nonsense, by one of the definitions of 'flies'".

Asking someone to "pick a number between 1 and 5" and actually meaning 2-4 is just being purposefully misleading, so it's not unreasonable for the person to assume you meant to say "pick a number from 1 to 5". "An integer between 1 and 5" (exclusive) and "an integer from 2 to 4" (inclusive) mean the same thing, but the second one makes it more clear that you can't pick 1 or 5.

I think the right way to handle a situation like this, like all other situations where a person could say one thing and possibly mean two or more different things, is with openness/understanding so nobody is an ass. If you find yourself being misinterpreted, try clarifying, or explain what you meant in a different way. If you misinterpret what someone else says, listen again to what they say, or try thinking of a different meaning.